Windows 7

[Griffin NoName]

Had a root around yesterday. It doesn't look all so bad. The interface doesn't seem so different. Files from earlier systems can just be copied over. I wont be upgrading as i dont see it has a lot to offer.

[Sibling Zono (anon1mat0)]

It's Vista SP2, really, a few less annoyances, faster, smaller memory footprint. I hate the bloody interface, but could be worse. If you can't stand oh-so-hideous Vista, do the upgrade and some of the annoyances should go away.

I'll be using XP until the games I like don't work in XP anymore. OTOH, have you tried ubuntu yet? If you don't play games and require proprietary M$ stuff (in my case SQL Server+Visual Studio) ubuntu is IMO vastly superior.

[Bob in a quantum-state-of-faith]

Had a root around yesterday. It doesn't look all so bad. The interface doesn't seem so different. Files from earlier systems can just be copied over. I wont be upgrading as i dont see it has a lot to offer.

Well....not quite, Re: "copied over".

You often have to cast some arcane spells before the idiot "protection" built into 7 lets you get away with that.

But the spells are not difficult to cast, just tedious.  As with everything microsquish-related.   

(not that hard to do, but often obscure to locate, and tedious....  but possible.  Once you know how.  As opposed to the mac, where it's dead-simple* or completely impossible.    )


________

_{* well, it is if you've never touched a computer before.  If you've grown up on computers, from main-frames to the modern PC's, then it's not dead-simple, but weird instead.  Doing things the "mac way" I mean... personally, I loathe their methodology, even though I recognize it's easy to learn-- if, you don't have years of alternative methods learned already}

[The Meromorph]

I converted to Windows 7 almost as soon as it came out. It was necessary (but very simple) to turn off the 'do you really want to do that?' function almost immediately, but, other than that it's been a big improvement over XP and Vista.
The default control panel structure was annoying,but easily changed, and since I found the 'GodMode' backdoor, i rarely use it anyway.
There have been very few 'security updates' etc...

[Bob in a quantum-state-of-faith]

I converted to Windows 7 almost as soon as it came out. It was necessary (but very simple) to turn off the 'do you really want to do that?' function almost immediately, but, other than that it's been a big improvement over XP and Vista.
The default control panel structure was annoying,but easily changed, and since I found the 'GodMode' backdoor, i rarely use it anyway.
There have been very few 'security updates' etc...

Turning off the "are you sure" does not disable the increased security issues.

But that does not matter-- much-- unless you're attaching a hard drive from a previous version of Windoze, what has security settings embedded in it's files-- say, an NTFS drive, and the "documents and settings" folder-- Win7 refuses to let you into that-- even though it's physically attached to your machine. 

You have to cast some arcane spells onto the old drive, first...  and no, "take ownership" does not work either-- inheritance.

It all stems from the fact that even an admin account in 7 is not quite an actual full-on-do-anything admin account.   There's still quite a few limits.  No doubt a 'feature' designed to 'protect' users from their own folly....

[Sibling Zono (anon1mat0)]

It all stems from the fact that even an admin account in 7 is not quite an actual full-on-do-anything admin account.   There's still quite a few limits.  No doubt a 'feature' designed to 'protect' users from their own folly....

Nope. It all stems from the fact that businesses and governments didn't want a person removing a hard drive and reading it's content easily. If the original partition had security settings then -according to them- it shouldn't be easy to read the info.

As for how usable the so-called 'feature' is, well, its M$ we're talking about...

[Bob in a quantum-state-of-faith]

It all stems from the fact that even an admin account in 7 is not quite an actual full-on-do-anything admin account.   There's still quite a few limits.  No doubt a 'feature' designed to 'protect' users from their own folly....

Nope. It all stems from the fact that businesses and governments didn't want a person removing a hard drive and reading it's content easily. If the original partition had security settings then -according to them- it shouldn't be easy to read the info.

As for how usable the so-called 'feature' is, well, its M$ we're talking about...

Idiots:  all they needed to do is encrypt the disks... that's been very simple to do since 2000 at least.

I hate having to put up with 'teh stupid' because others are too lazy to do it right in the first place...

[Sibling DavidH]

I found the 'GodMode' backdoor...

Do tell us!  I have never played with W7 yet, but next time I buy a new machine I'll be stuck with it, good or bad.

[Bob in a quantum-state-of-faith]

I found the 'GodMode' backdoor...

Do tell us!  I have never played with W7 yet, but next time I buy a new machine I'll be stuck with it, good or bad.

It's an old, leftover "hidden" way to present all the apps/controls that the Control Panel, Computer Management, etc, in one place, in a list-form.

http://news.cnet.com/8301-13860_3-10423985-56.html

Been around awhile, but does not expose additional controls:  it's just the existing rights, in a list form, all in one place.

Coders and advanced users like that, though.

But it does not eliminate the problem with Windoze7's decreased control issues under an 'admin' account.

About the only way around this one, is to re-enable the hidden "Administrator" account, using a command-line program (if you've only purchased one of the 'home' flavors of Win7.... the advanced ones have a GUI that also lets you re-enable the hidden admin account).

But even then, the un-hidden 'Administrator' account is locked-out of many of the previously-available abilities.  That "security" again.

There's ways around this, the easiest (but still tedious) is another command-line sequence.  (That's why I refereed to them as "arcane spells"    )

I suppose I ought to post some of those spells, here...

[Bob in a quantum-state-of-faith]

(for clarity, I'm going to post these in a new post)

Edit:  Okay, I'm gonna put this tip here, at the top, Just In Case.  Before doing **anything** you need to know the password for your **current** account, if any.

If you've removed it?  No worries (You'll know, because when you power-on your PC, Win7 comes up without asking you anything...)

If you have to enter a password to get into Win7-- and you know it?  You're Fine.  If you have forgotten?  Now is the time to fix that.....  While you Still Can. But that's a whole 'nuther topic...

How to re-enable the hidden Administrator account in Vista/Win7:

(from How-to-Geek)

(here's another take on it: enable hidden admin )

Click on the "START" thingy (typically lower-left corner).

In the find box (not the "RUN" option), type [cmd].  Windoze does a search, and brings up (above) the results-- "cmd.exe" under "Programs".  The next step is **important**.

Right-click on these results-- not left as is usual.   In the context-menu (pop-up) click "Run as Administrator".  If asked, click "allow".

This opens up the black box with white text.  Nevermind where it's currently pointed to, not important.

In that black "CMD" box, type the following spell:

Code Select Expand

net user administrator /active:yes

It ought to trundle a bit, and return:  "the command completed successfully."  If not, try again-- maybe cut-and-paste the spell?     Did you skip the "run as administrator" step?   

Once you get the confirmation that your spell was cast successfully, simply log out of Windoze: Next to the "shut down" there's a little triangle thingy, click it.

You may either choose "log off" or "switch user".  Choose "administrator", and you're in.... maybe.

There may be a problem with the above spell, though... the password on the "administrator" account.  If it had been set previously, by you (did you forget) during setup, or by whomever installed Win7 on your box?  You are stuck....maybe.

There's another spell to fix that issue, too.  Log back into *your* account, in that case... (you remembered your password...right?  If not?  You're seriously hosed, here.... there are fixes, but most involve creating a Linux bootable CD... and for that, you need to be logged in... *sigh*)

Okay, you're back into YOUR account, right?

You need that "run as administrator" CMD thingy, again.  Go back and re-open it, as administrator, just like above. 

In the CMD black-with-white letters, cast the following spell:

Code Select Expand

Net user administrator password

Obviously, the word 'password' is a very crappy value for your Administrator's password... so you probabily want to subsitute something else, say the name of your first pet?  Or how about the name of your favorite aunt's pet, instead?  Perhaps the name of the city where you first vacationed on your own?   Maybe the title of the first novel you wrote?  Okay, you get the picture...

In any case, you'll get the same results from that spell, as the previous one:  "the command completed successfully."

*Now* you can log out/switch users, whatever:  you'll know the new password of your newly-enabled 'Administrator' account.

{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}

For the security-conscious among us, there's a counter-spell to the above, namely one that lets you re-disable that nasty ole' administrator account:

Again, with the CMD box (as administrator, to be sure)

Cast the following spell:

Code Select Expand

net user administrator /active:no

Hey!  That actually made sense....

*shhhhhhhhh*

Don't let Microsoft know...

[Bob in a quantum-state-of-faith]

Part 2:  How to take control of an old hard disk that was previously installed under WinV, WinXP, Win2K, WinNT, etc-- any previous version that utilized NTFS disk.  Fat32 disks do not typically have the ability to lock-out files.   NTFS was the default disk format, shortly after Win2k was released, and was available in WinNT.  Some Win2k/WinXP installers were sloppy, and forced the older FAT/FAT32 format anyway.  If your old disk is FAT/FAT32?  You'll experience no problems under Win7.

Anyway, there's a series of spells you can cast, to force-ownership of that old disk you just installed into your new Win7 machine.

Once again?  You'll need that "run as administrator" CMD thingy.   Think of it as your pentagram, in which you must cast your spells. 

Owning a disk is kinda complex, due to a series of settings Microsquish decided was "an advantage".  They most expressly did not specify for whom the advantage was targeted...

The chief culprit, (to me) that leads to confusion, is that nasty little obscure ability:  "inheritance".  It's a flag (at the deepest, most arcane level of being) that tells Windoze if a file/directory/disk inherits attributes or not.   Inherits?  Like getting all 50 of your maiden aunt's nearly feral cats, as a condition of her will?  Yeah, sorta like that.

Only this means that the object in question (file, whatever) inherits the attributes from the parent-- if the flag is checked.  If not?  It has it's own set of rights/attributes.

Attributes?  Like long nose, blonde hair and big feet?  Sorta.  In the world of files, 'attributes' include visibility, archive status, read-only (cannot write or modify if yes) and such things.  These were present since DOS 1.0.  Then, there are more complex rights, introduced in Windows NT, with NTFS.   These things tell Windoze if a given user (that's YOU, by the way) can do whatever to the file, or cannot even look at it, let alone something else...   It's these higher-order of rights that is preventing Win7 from accessing that removed-from-previous-win disk.

Okay:  inheritance goes both ways:  up AND down.    If a given file/directory has "inherit from parent" checked, then it gets a copy of whatever the higher-level directory had, up to the highest, the root-directory of the disk itself.  Typically the root is expressed as "D:\" if the drive is "D".   If the file/directory does not have this item checked, then it keeps it's rights/attributes all to itself, ignoring any set by the parent.

The problem with older disks, is that there is an interesting mix of checked-and-not-checked inheritance.

That's where the tedium comes in--- or does it?

If you use the "lovely" GUI interface, you'll be forced to look at each and every single file, to see if the box is checked or no...   This could be literally thousands of individual files, under your "My Documents" folder.... or worse.  (yes, it could get worse:  profiles can be hidden from view, and you can't even SEE the files you need....)

The way we work that, though, is to force down those rights from the very top-level itself.   First, we force-assign the rights of the root-drive over to the current user, or to the Administrator group (a bit safer, but you must be in the administrator group to get access).

Next, we cast a command-line spell, to force those newly polished rights downwards to every single file on the drive-- that can take hours, if the drive is slow.  But, it's well worth the wait.

Fixing up the rights of the root drive can be done using the standard GUI interface:  Open "My Computer", run as administrator, right-click on the offending drive, say "E:" and click on "properties".  Select the "Security" tab.  Select "Advanced".  Select "owner" tab.  In the lower box, choose "administrators" or your own accout (will have your log-in name), and click "take ownership". Wait.    Back in the 'Security' tab, click "Edit".  Highlight either the "adminstrators" group or your account.  Make sure "Full Control" is checked.  Click "okay".  Wait.

Next, you must reboot, or log-off, log-on.  That makes these newly adjusted root-permissions/rights take full effect.  You really cannot skip this step, sorry...

(one of the many pitfalls I experienced.... )

Now.  You want to propagate these new rights down through the whole disk-- if you have an advanced copy of Win7, there's a GUI way, but I don't so I don't know how it works.   I only know the spell.

Open that "as administrator" CMD box thingy.  By now, you ought to be expert.

Cast the one of the following spells (note-- replace "E:" with your drive's actual letter...)

Code Select Expand

TAKEOWN /A /F /R E:\
---or---

Code Select Expand

TAKEOWN /F /R E:\

Yeah, this seems redundant, but it's an important step:  it will force ownership of **all** the files, from the root directory on down...

The first spell, forces ownership to the "Administrator" group. The second forces it to *your* username.  Either method ought to work, if your account is in the "administrator" group, and the first one is slightly more secure..

In case you're wondering, what makes this 'go' is the "/R" switch:  it causes the spell to be cast on the whole disk, and not just the root-directory itself.  It stands for "recurse".   

(for a list of all the arcane settings, cast the following spell

Code Select Expand

TAKEOWN /?\

It will list out all the options in casting this particular spell, and sortof explains them... by the way, the above spell doesn't do anything-- it's purely informative.  Well, sortof... )

Now, assuming you used the first spell, you need to assign full permissions to the administrator with another arcane command:

Code Select Expand

ICACLS /T /C E:\*.*  /grant administrators:F

(again, there is an informative spell for this one too, [ICACLS /?]  The language is rather arcane, though... and not much help to ordinary mortals. )

Note that the "/T" forces these rights down through the whole disk, specified by the "*.*" after the drive's formal name. 

Note also, the "/C" lets the command complete it's travels, even if a file is corrupted, and not accessable under any circumstances.  Occasionally happens-- this way, your spell can complete on the remainder of the files, so you don't have to start over.

If you elected to use your own log-in name, in the ownership spell, substitute it for 'administrators' above.   You may use "*" in place of any spaces in your log-in name.

Let the above run-- it may take several hours to complete.

If you really want to see the output of the above spell-- including any errors (useful, if your disk is having problems) you can direct the entire output to a file on another disk, using the following variant-- note:  Putting the output on another disk is pretty much a must, else you'll get write conflicts when the command tries to modify the output file that is being written to-- a recursion error, if you must know.

Code Select Expand

ICACLS /T /C E:\*.*  /grant administrators:F > C:\temp\filechage.txt

You won't see anything happening that way, but when it finishes, it will release the command prompt (you'll see a new line, with a blinking thingy, underneath the spell-command).  Note:  make sure that the C: drive has a folder named "temp".  Else you'll get an error.

Then, open the file (C:\temp\filechange.txt" to look at all the lovely list of files on your old E: drive.... )

That's it:  you've successfully taken full control of that disk that was previously installed into an old WinXXX machine...

References:

WinHelpOnline
TechTalkz

[Sibling DavidH]

Hey, Bob, thanks for that link.  I created the file in my Vista 32-bit and bingo!  The file filled up with goodies!

[Bob in a quantum-state-of-faith]

Here's the latest twist in Windoze 7 saga-- more hidden goodies only available in the pricier versions.

It seems that Microsuck correctly concluded they needed to include more compatibility than their compatibility wizard stupid can provide.

So they thoughtfully created a virtual XP to run within Windoze 7-- this is a simulated PC running full XP, running within the win7 OS.

Virtualized XP's have been around since CrApple, in a much-lamented move, dropped their venerable Motorola line of cpu's and went over to the Dark Side, Intel.  (savvy readers will note that I'm a bit hypocritical, here, and I'm running on an Intel cpu myself....  )   That is, if you have one of the more modern CrApple computers, you can actually install a simulated XP on it-- only it's not simulated from the viewpoint of XP itself!  XP thinks it's running on an older Intel cpu all by itself, only one that has a kind of weird access to the outside world...... and yes, you had to pay Micr$oft for a genuine XP license..... (many savvy readers will immediately ask, 'why' and 'why not just buy a cheaper PC' and other reasonable questions.  Only a dyed in the wool Appleiphyle can answer those. )

Now, seeing as how I have a legitimate XP license, should I not be able to simply install the virtualization shell into my Win7, and then "install" a virtual XP within that?

Apparently not:  I neglected to purchase enough shares in M$, apparently,  for the heinous sin of buying Home Premium, I am denied this option.  And yes, I have finally figured out the meaning of the word "Premium" with respect to Micro$oft:   "Premium" stands for "Premium Profits for Microsoft"..... naturally.   

I can "upgrade" my Home Premium to Professional, for a [sarcasm]measly $90.... and get an "instant update".   Translation:  for my all-but-$100, they will helpfully unlock the software already installed on my computer.

Lovely.

So, the next time I have an extra sawbuck to throw out the window, I'll do it, and report back.

Don't hold your breath.....

Meanwhile, back to my dual-boot technique.

[Griffin NoName]

It all stems from the fact that businesses and governments didn't want a person removing a hard drive and reading it's content easily...............

In the UK it's because they leave them on the train, or the bus, etc. 

[Bob in a quantum-state-of-faith]

Well, well, well.

If Redmond can do something, there's a good chance, a 3rd party can do it better:  VMware.

Apparently the VM player, which stands for "Virtual Machine Player" can create a virtual PC within your existing PC.   There are various flavors available, including a Linux one (runs a VM on a Linux box).

To evaluate the player is free.  I've not located a definitive purchase price, but it appears to be less than $70US.   For my money, I'd much prefer giving it to a clever bunch of boffins not working for The Dark Side.... but that's strictly from a strong personal bias... 

In any case, this virtual machine is a literal simulated PC running within your Win7/Vista/XP machine!  There's documentation (PDF file) on how to install to your VM, Win7, Vista, XP (various flavors), Win 2000, WinMe, Win 98, Win 95.  There's even a section on how to install venerable MS-DOS.  Really.  And, of course, various flavors of Linux as well. 

The way you create your VM is highly customizable, including disk size, memory size, if you want sound or no, the type of CD-ROM, etc.   This machine then takes up some space on your disk-- depending on how big you made it's "home" drive.   So, for example, if you wanted to duplicate that lovely old 8086 MS-DOS machine and play some of those old venerable games from the 80's, you could:  set up a 500meg drive (plenty for MS-DOS-- in fact, ginormous. )  Once setup, you'd see a 500meg file on your host machine's drive.   And within that 500 meg, would reside your MS-DOS files...

.... I haven't actually tried this, yet.  I signed up for an evaluation copy, which was trouble-free, and I've downloaded the appropriate VM thingy.   I have to read the docs a bit more-- for XP and up, they recommend adding VM Tools to aid in the configuration of the VM machine.   For XP, you'd need at a bare minimum 2gigs.  20gigs is more like it.

It seems the VM machine can be configured to "see" drives not within it's scope-- in other words, you could set this thing up, such that it can see other hardware (such as extra hard drives) in your PC.

To "start up" your VM machine, you press the cute "power" button, apparently.  To stop it, you "power off" as usual within it.  Cute. 

While it's running, it apparently uses whatever memory you allocated, say 1gig of your main machine's RAM-- good enough for most XP installs.  Too much for MS-DOS-- for that, you only need to allocate the venerable 1M....    I have programs that use more than that...

Okay, I'll play around with this thing, and report back.

Cheers!