Now... I was just logging into my Yahoo! messanger and This http://movies.yahoo.com/news/movies.ap.org/vatican-says-avatar-no-masterpiece-ap
captured my attention..
Now I have seen Avatar and I am not particulary found of it only because my impression was of just another Big guns vs good guys movies and they make me nervous and mad...
The only thing I have appreciated about the movie was the fact that somebody has had the gutts to bring onto the big screen the Spiritualism of Nature that organized religion has attempted to wipe clean for two thousand years...
what really makes me laugh is that the Catholic church still feels threatned by the "witches"....
but if the Old Religion was so false... why bother???
It really makes me wonder LOL :mrgreen:
I wouldn't even call that critique... :headbang:
The reason?
I guess the old men of the Vatican feel the power that their religion used to hold over people is slipping away.
And what better way to get the sheeps back in the enclosure than telling them about the big bad wolf... Hoping the sheep will be so scared they'll jump right back over the fence where they can be duly punished for trying to think for them self.
I haven't seen the movie yet, but perhaps I should...
There are definitively more subversive movies (the upcoming Legion may possibly be quite subversive, or even the castrated Golden Compass), but when the movie is a hit that millions -possibly billions- of people will watch they have reason to be touchy even if there is no specific discourse on the movie.
Specifically, in the movie the Na'vi don't worship nature but communicate with it, but apparently the link of tails is a worrisome metaphor for the Vatican. Ironically by criticizing the movie they actually come as anti-environmentalists even when supposedly the pope is for the respect of the environment.
I guess my ranking of the Catholic faith in the other thread is justified...
I liked Avatar. Fern Gully with guns and the visuals were stunning, even if I do agree with some critics when they note the following:
QuoteBlog posts, newspaper articles, tweets and YouTube videos have criticized the film, with some calling it "a fantasy about race told from the point of view of white people" and that it reinforces "the white Messiah fable." Cameron says the real theme is about respecting others' differences.
The RCC makes me giggle.
Quote from: L'Osservatore RomanoBenedict has often spoken about the need to protect the environment, earning the nickname of "green pope."
There's a photo manip in there somewhere... :giggle:
Personally?
I think the RCC had invested some serious coin, hinging on the success of the movie.
And to ensure the widest possible audience (and hence, the highest return on their coin) they immediately criticized it.
Nothing makes a movie more successful, than criticism from the holy C....
<eyeroll>
One would actually expect some right-wingers to like the movie. The hero is accepted by the tribe because he is a warrior (not one of these weakling science guys that tried earlier and failed). And the white messaiah leading the natives to victory falls into a similar category. The true leader of the white invaders dies fighting for what he believes, so he too could be an identification figure for a certain kind of people.
Well, of course the movie is liberal with the subtlety of a sledgehammer :mrgreen: but what else would you expect from Cameron? ;)
Thus the Vatican's critique has something for it as far as it stays out of theological arguments. That the movie could lead to a significant number of people to switch from Roman Catholic to Wiccan is on the other hand preposterous.
Btw, how did the church react to E.T.?
The first critique to be expected from 'Christians' would have to be about lots of (near) nudity and a sex scene not content. ;)
Apparently the 'sex' scene* was edited out and will be in the DVD extended version.
*the joining of the tails... ::)
Can't remember whether that was in or not in the cinema. But they went to work on each other in any case explicitly enough :mrgreen:
---
As for Weaver smoking, I think it is obvious in the movie that it is an undesirable habit. And who the netherworld cares unless it turns into an ad.
One could only wonder where she gets the cigarettes, if there is no plant life left on Earth (or did her family do a Kennedy-before the-Cuba-embargo, storing several life supplies of the stuff before it became unavailable? ;))
I imagine it's no more wild plant life on Earth, so all of it is made of crops.
Or it could be synthetic cigarettes. Nicotine is a relatively simple compound.
Is the brand name visible anywhere?
Cigarettes seem a bit anachronistic for the future. Nicotine, OTOH, is here to stay.
Surprised the drug companies haven't figured out how to covertly market nicotine gum as 'cool', should appeal to the energy-drink crowd. Better packaging might help.
In an old Czech SciFi movie (Ikarie XB1) cigarettes have been replaced by a kind of smelling stick, so the habit of fingering theses little things remains but without (I suppose) the negative effects on health.
the vatican are racist against blue people.
they hate the smurfs too
Quote from: goat starer on January 15, 2010, 12:46:13 PM
they hate the smurfs too
That might explain where my 20% Catholic score came from. I can't think of any other explanation...
Would be interesting to read what the Vatican statement actually said, instead of a few snippets in a Yahoo article. Say what you will about the Vatican, they might be conservative loonies at times, but they usually know how to write decent and well-structured criticism. ;)
I managed to "alternatively aquire" a copy of Avatar, and I was very glad I didn't pay the exorbitant ticket prices to watch it in a cinema. To put it simply, I did not like the movie at all.
Much as Swatopluk already has mentioned, I found it to be a rather strong dose of Noble Savage-exoticism, with of course the white, civilized, warrior, being the one who is able to blend Civilization with Nature and lead the uncorrupted Savages against the horrible over-civilized (but still somewhat OK) empire, and of course thumbing his nose against a few poofy scientists and corporate executives while doing so. Much the same premise as Dances with Wolves, Last Samurai and a score of other movies. Go Marlboro Man!
I would hardly call the movie "liberal", even in the US sense, but I think Theodore Roosevelt would have liked it, what with it's warnings against civilization making us soft and effeminate and the turn-of-the century "recapitulation" ideology, about how Western Civilzed Man had to embrace and at the same time control His Inner Savage in order to evolve and not degenerate. Strenous life, soft talk, big sticks and all that.
Yuck.
I wonder what the vatican would say about this ;)
http://www.alternet.org/sex/145180/why_do_people_want_to_have_sex_with_the_9-foot_tall_natives_in_%27avatar%27/
Quote from: Lindorm on January 15, 2010, 01:35:54 PM
I managed to "alternatively aquire" a copy of Avatar, and I was very glad I didn't pay the exorbitant ticket prices to watch it in a cinema. To put it simply, I did not like the movie at all.
It's easily available on streaming video sites. C found it, but I didn't want to watch it - IF I see it I'll shell out the cash for the 3-D, put the glasses on and my brain off. Can't see the point of watching it otherwise. I'll wait for Alice, which may be actually worth watching for something besides the 3-D, despite Disnefication.
Quote from: Swatopluk on January 15, 2010, 01:45:18 PM
I wonder what the vatican would say about this ;)
http://www.alternet.org/sex/145180/why_do_people_want_to_have_sex_with_the_9-foot_tall_natives_in_%27avatar%27/
I lol'd. ;D
Quote from: Sibling Zono (anon1mat0) on January 14, 2010, 12:42:07 PM
Apparently the 'sex' scene* was edited out and will be in the DVD extended version.
*the joining of the tails... ::)
I think I saw that, actually.
Lindorm: I got that vibe, too.
Must also add this.
(http://img31.imageshack.us/img31/3867/poca2u.jpg)
It works until:
Quote"...and the two cultures resolve their differences."
It has been suggested that there will be [a] sequel(s) so the similarities with the true story might show up, although it is expected that at the end of the sequel(s) the rosy ending will show up.
---
Apparently some USMC colonel didn't like the film either (http://www.dailytech.com/Avatar+May+Be+Global+Smash+but+USMC+Not+Amused/article17370.htm):
Quote from: DailyTechSalas slams the movie since it reportedly "takes sophomoric shots at our military culture and uses the lore of the Marine Corps and over-the-top stereotyping of Marine warriors to set the context for the screenplay. This does a disservice to our Corps of Marines and the publics' understanding of their Corps."
Perhaps he didn't get the part where it's made clear that those are mercenaries?
Scriblerous: Regarding the whole Pocahontas thing, I can only say this:
:bwa:
Quote from: Sibling Zono (anon1mat0) on January 17, 2010, 05:08:55 AM
Perhaps he didn't get the part where it's made clear that those are mercenaries?
Then again, there are the (in)famous words of former USMC Major-General Smedley Butler:
I spent 33 years and four months in active military service and during that period I spent most of my time as a high class muscle man for Big Business, for Wall Street and the bankers. In short, I was a racketeer, a gangster for capitalism. I helped make Mexico and especially Tampico safe for American oil interests in 1914. I helped make Haiti and Cuba a decent place for the National City Bank boys to collect revenues in. I helped in the raping of half a dozen Central American republics for the benefit of Wall Street. I helped purify Nicaragua for the International Banking House of Brown Brothers in 1902-1912. I brought light to the Dominican Republic for the American sugar interests in 1916. I helped make Honduras right for the American fruit companies in 1903. In China in 1927 I helped see to it that Standard Oil went on its way unmolested. Looking back on it, I might have given Al Capone a few hints. The best he could do was to operate his racket in three districts. I operated on three continents.
Quote from: goat starer on January 15, 2010, 12:46:13 PM
the vatican are racist against blue people.
they hate the smurfs too
ROTFL! :cthulhu:
Alas, the Pope is a poopyhead. :P
A poppy head?
(http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_lDfVXMCBuu0/SHnybVaPeZI/AAAAAAAAAbE/L9S29ard568/s400/opium-poppy-seed-pod%2B%2813%29.JPG)
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_lDfVXMCBuu0/SHnybVaPeZI/AAAAAAAAAbE/L9S29ard568/s400/opium-poppy-seed-pod%2B%2813%29.JPG
;)
Funny stuff. Apparently, I completely missed this whole thread back in January...
... I love the direct comparison to Avitar and the legend of Pocahontas.