Dabbling in Vegetarianism (& other alt-food fun!)

[Aggie]

So, here's a topic that would fit neatly in Food, EH & NH, or Money Saving tips....  but let's not forget it's about food foremost!

I am a dedicated omnivore, but we've been eating less meat lately for several reasons - the biggest factors are health (paranoia about contaminants, additives and BSE, traditional concerns like cholesterol and saturated fats), environmental concerns (factory farming) and $$$!  And overall, I'm finding that subbing out some or all of the meat I eat just feels better.  The big key for us has been to ignore whether there's meat in a meal, and just eat what's tasty.  Too much emphasis cutting the meat can leave you with boring food, but pursuing tasty dishes that just happen to not include meat is delicious!  From a 'fun to cook' perspective, reducing the meat has kept me from following the same old ruts, and given me an opportunity to work with new flavours and ingredients - YAY!  I find that this is also true of low-fat cooking... if you stop taking the lazy fat/salt route to flavour, you get to play with fun spices and your tastebuds think they've gone to the Big Tongue in the Sky! 
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We've also been trying to integrate some more organic foods into the diet, where it's cost effective - this involves some strategy in targeting 'high-risk' foods, and focusing on reasonably-priced organic produce.  Some of the organic products we are using are actually cheaper than non-organic national brands, and the yardstick I hold for produce is 'Would I pay this price for non-organic produce?' - even if it's not the cheapest price, is it reasonable for that item?   Some items have been relegated to treats only, like yogurt - the organic stuff is much tastier, but more expensive, so we just eat it once in a while.  Other items like butter and eggs are significantly more expensive, but worth buying because we use so little.  Actually, especially with produce, the organic stuff is just tastier, and therefore worth the small premium. 
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The biggest problems I've been having lately is to find some viable alternative sources for meat - traditional  organic meats are ridiculously expensive.  If we ate enough meat to justify buying a whole cow or even a side (split with others), there'd be more options, such as having a local farmer raise an animal for me - but with the meat reduction, it's not an option.  I might look into a lamb instead, which would be a more manageable amount of meat, and tastier! Organic or free-range poultry should be easier to track down.  I really need to start hunting again (best option), but I'm not well set up for that right now. 


Anyways, after much rambling... I'll turn over the thread to the rest of y'all to give some more perspectives on going veggie et al.   

[anthrobabe]

Going veg was one of the more difficult things I've ever done- I still slip and I've never been totally vegan.

I think starting slow helps- it helped me- going "cold turkey" will not work for most people.

There are some meat substitute items that are quite tasty and nutritious- some are truthfully just gross and nasty. so I'd encourage you to check your local supermarket- and not just the "vegetarian section" either- many companies (like Hormel vegetarian chili) have vegetarian products in their line. I like to make things at home- so get to know products like Seitan and such. Experiment and see what you like.

some good online places are pangea.org, vegweb(I think it's a .com)and vegan resource guide-- they also have links to suppliers of good quality veg products.

Cost can be a problem- if you aren't careful you can spend way over budget-so like you were saying - be inventive.

I don't think going vegetarian is for everyone- I think it is a healthy lifestyle and all but I'm not going to say to another that they have to do it my way or they are like bad or something- to each his own. I do want everyone to stop and do some investigation of factory farming and cruelty however- then make up your own mind.

All are welcome at the anthrobabe's table! And I'll even cook for you!

[Aggie]

Hey - anthrobabe! Good to see you!

The funny thing about me and eating veggie - I almost never think of my protein-ingredients as 'meat substitutes', and have a definite dislike for anything pretending to be meat*.  I also am skeptical about the health or cost benefits of replacing meat with a highly-processed soy protein product or similar, so we usually stick to plain tofu or often just go straight vegetables; we usually throw some mixed grains or beans in with the rice, and I'm starting to get the feel for lentil dishes (love 'em!).  I rarely buy pre-packaged foods containing meat, so there's no need to find veggie replacements.

I think part of the difficulty in switching over to a veggie diet for many people is getting used to the idea that one doesn't need a meat-type dish at every meal.  It took a while for me to get out of the habit, but I think I've had an easier time than some because I like to cook mostly one-pot type dishes rather than the 'meat and two veg' routine.  Meat becomes simply another ingredient, not the main focus, especially if you are already using a large variety of vegetables!  It's not unheard of for us to use both tofu and meat in the same dish, especially if you count fish cake and things like that, but leaving it out usually doesn't fundamentally change the meal.  I think it helps to be a bit lazy too... we usually keep some tofu in the fridge, and it's easier to whip up a quick dinner with it than to thaw out a chunk of meat last-minute.   

It's funny, but even these little adjustment have changed my appetite for meat... I still enjoy chicken as much as ever, but really could care less about eating beef now.  I'm never planning to quit completely - I like food in general too much!

_{*I loooves veggie burgers that aren't the 'beef-substitute' type, particularly the Yves Garden Vegetable Patties.}

I do want everyone to stop and do some investigation of factory farming and cruelty however- then make up your own mind.

Aye, I'm appalled at factory farming, particularly from an environmental and an epidemiological POV.  The modern meat industry (both production and processing) makes me dearly want to start hunting again - at least I can take personal control and responsibility for any suffering inflicted and minimize it as much as possible.  It's no fun at all to kill something, but personally, it's the living conditions of the animals in FF rather than the method of dispatch that bothers me - bush animals at least live a natural life.  I know it's a distasteful subject for vegetarians, but I can't believe how many supermarket meat-eaters consider table-hunting to be 'cruel' or 'gross'.  Contrary to popular belief, beef doesn't grow on trees.. 

[Bob in a quantum-state-of-faith]

I did the veggy-diet for a number of years, several years ago.

I started it for health reasons, and to impress a girl. 

I stayed with it because I liked it (I never got around to actually telling that particular girl, alas, and I haven't seen her in years ...)

I gradually re-introduced meat into my diet, but minimal portions.  I often go several days meatless, then sometimes I binge and only have an oven roasted chicken breast for supper.

Since I have low blood sugar, I find that the easiest way to keep that in check, is with protein.

And here in the US, meat proteins are the cheapest, and sometimes I'm just too tired to veggy-out.

But, I DO prefer low-meat diets most times.  I think I've been doing that for many, many years now.  Most folk get 'way too much meat than they need (or that is good for them).

And, I prefer those veggy-chili's.  Taste is more subtle and complex than the meat-encrusted ones, I think. 

[Opsa]

Mmm... I just re-heated some Triangle Bean Curd Family Style that I ordered from our local Chinese restaurant last Saturday and it was EVEN BETTER than it was Saturday night.

I have been vegetarian for many years (put my foot down about eating meat at age sixteen, that's all I'll say) and I agree with you guys, fake meat is NOT the way to go! It tends to be too mealy and slimey.

I still do dairy though, being a cheese-aholic. I love quiches and cheese souffles- especially the ones with spinach- yum! I am not big on cooking, but I have a few recipes so simple that even a kitchen bumbler like me can pull them off.

[Aggie]

Mmm... I just re-heated some Triangle Bean Curd Family Style that I ordered from our local Chinese restaurant last Saturday and it was EVEN BETTER than it was Saturday night.

That's probably a good tip for veggie cooking (and cookery in general) - anything 'one dish' that has a fair amount of liquid (soups, stews, sauces, etc.) ALWAYS tastes better the next day, especially if using strong spices, a variety of flavours or items like tofu that 'take on' the flavour of what they are cooked with. 

[Opsa]

So are you saying that we should work on tomorrow's dinner tonight?

[Aggie]

I'm starting to think that's the most sensible thing to do, though I rarely get motivated enough after dinner.  For the working types, it's the easiest way to get a hot meal on the table FAST, and then one can put it together the next night's fare at leisure.  I would like to at minimum do a twice-weekly ingredient prep (slice the veggies up etc), but that probably wouldn't work with the way we cook these days - different foods need different textures and sizes of ingredients.  I did lay up a bunch of frozen garlic puree cubes, though, which have been handy.

For the two of us, we find that less meat-intensive foods are quite easy to prepare in large enough quantities to hold over for more than one meal - hotpots in particular seem to easily stretch for 2 dinners and sometimes lunches between, and only require a new pot of rice if the old one gets used up.  I looooooves hotpot! 

Gotta get the fridge re-stocked with kimchi and a variety of Korean side dishes this week, too.  Korean-style meals are easy as pie...  a hot dish or soup is nice, but in a pinch we can make a meal of side dishes, rice and kim (seasoned seaweed sheets, kind of like tastier, salted sushi wraps).

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Oh, side note.... I've been sprouting lentils lately, and they make a good addition either to the rice pot (when small) or to the main fare (when tall).

[anthrobabe]

I agree with what some of you are saying about replacing meat with fake heavily processed meat substitutes- not really much of a benefit overall(health wise) so while I think some of the analogues ( spelling?) are good and nutritious but simply being vegetarian ( on the label) doesn't mean it is necessarily better or nutritious--- so good points.

I most certainly think that any hunted meat is probably going to be more nutritious that factory farmed meat- and it's not really barbaric and cruel at all to hunt-- responsible hunters are the rule - it's the morons who give it a bad name. Of course I'm not a hunter myself- just not for me.

Adding beans and upping amounts of vegetables to any dish is a good way to go- and it very often stretches the food budget and such. I do not like GMO foods- but how can we stop them-- now that's one to ponder.

[Aggie]

I most certainly think that any hunted meat is probably going to be more nutritious that factory farmed meat- and it's not really barbaric and cruel at all to hunt-- responsible hunters are the rule - it's the morons who give it a bad name. Of course I'm not a hunter myself- just not for me.

I don't actually advocate hunting (since it's only sustainable if there are relatively few hunters), and any moron who kills for the sake of killing should have their guns taken, or be hunted down and shot. 
Going veggie is still more efficient, although the upside of bush meat is that the animals are browsing on plants which aren't generally food sources for humans - unlike grain-fed beef.

Adding beans and upping amounts of vegetables to any dish is a good way to go- and it very often stretches the food budget and such. I do not like GMO foods- but how can we stop them-- now that's one to ponder.

Ach - another problem!  The individual solution is "grow yer own" - easier for the veg, tougher for the grains.  I suppose consumer pressure will be the key - education, education, education!  I'm not actually against all GMO foods in principle, but from what I've seen the technology isn't being used for the good - crops like "RoundUp Ready" cereals really bother me - shouldn't we be using biotechnology to replace our dependence on pesticides, not increase it?  It's scary that GMO crops likely are/will be used without disclosing the nature of the modifications. I'm also concerned at the loss of genetic diversity in crop plants - wherever 'supercrops', GMO or not, totally replace historical varieties, we are in deep doo doo.

Bleah, the sick part about this all is that the old locally-distributed family farm, raising a variety of crops and animals, is much more ecologically sustainable than chemically-supported monocultures and feedlots, and goes a long way in solving the problems we're talking about (plus, there's less need for transporting, and the dollars stay local).  Yet the chain supermarkets in general won't distribute foods unless they are shipped through the official supply channels - why in the heck would I want to buy US apples when the orchard up the road is in peak production? :p

[anthrobabe]

Oh sure thing about killing just to be killing- that is an assured no-no. And the idea about sustainability is a good point-- if all 6 billion plus take up arms and go "huntin" we are really going to be in trouble.

Gmo and patenting seeds and such is the way things are going- I wonder what Mendel would think? I read on the net about having a 100 mile holiday dinner- the idea is to only consume foods from with in 100 miles of ones home--- very thought provoking-- the local large market doesn't lend itself to this idea and the farmers markets are very seasonal in general (at least around here).

I would love to have 10 acres and a garden with an orchard-- I have an organic gardening book from the 1970's ( about 1000 pages) and it has a wonderful plan for a 1 acre orchard. But I don't think it's feasable for every family any longer to have the live off your own land model-- we've just moved on from that.( at least in the USA)

[Sibling Chatty]

We're lucky to be in a fairly rural area, and to have the availability of small farmer/rancher produced foods. I have been able to eliminate a lot of the supermarket meats from our diet, although we cannot ever eliminate meat. (I'm always behind on my protein consumption, and will be until we can find a powder supplement that is ONLY whey protein, not 'with a little egg in with it' or 'some soy'. Yay allergies.)

I'm searching for a good source for chicken, one that doesn't add color and fluid to a basic chicken. I KNOW what deceased chickens are supposed to look like, and that supermarket, water-bloated and yellow dyed stuff isn't it. We have to locate and get approval on all my food sources before I will be allowed to do the Indium-111 trial since one of the recent participants got very ill from some home-processed SOMETHING (gossip says homemade yogurt from unpasteurized milk) so we're all being grilled about diet.

I considered just writing in Taco Bell and seeing how fast I got yelled at...

Anyway, the County Agricultural Agent is trying to find fresh chicken for me. Eggs? Not a problem, except the egg allergy... He has pointed us to a guy who ranches and cuts his own meat for a tiny meat market (open 3 days a week) and we've made friends at a couple of local sausage 'plants' where the meat is all homegrown, no feedlots, no (as one guy put it) "ass-troids feedin' steroids, and not all full of drugs".

In order to keep me as healthy as possible, we're trying to cut the yucky stuff completely, so food gathering is becoming an adventure. I was griping about driving 15 miles to a grocery store. We now dive 34 miles to the meat market. And sometimes, we get chased inside by next week's pot roast, too, because it's still out walking around!

Dan's been invited deer hunting, and there are a lot of people around here that DO hunt for the table. You know you're in rural Texas when someone says something about someone shooting an animal that's not edible, and if the answer to "Was it eatin' his crops?" is no, the next comment is "Asshole." Dan didn't go hunting this year, but might next year, or the year after, if the headcount on deer gets really high again. (If they aren't reduced in level, then they start overpopulation starvation, and illness sets in, etc.) This year was a little high count, so it depends on the count prior to next season.

I grew up on what was raised and hunted for the table, so it won't bother me. (I may resort to growing my own chickens, but I don't want to process them. I pluck 'em, but that's it.) I figure if the guy down the street can raise a couple hogs in the back yard, a pen of chickens won't be a problem.

[anthrobabe]

Was looking around for some recipies- sources for a pastry(nazook) Darlica was talking about and came across this web site----

many - vegetarian products here=http://www.kalamala.com/specials.php  I pasted the 'specials' page but you can navigate from it.

[Opsa]

I got an "address not found" on that, AB. Please post again.

Recently many of our chain grocery stores have been offering organic and vegetarian lines at generic prices and that's very encouraging to a lazy cook such as myself.

Recently we have been thinking of ways to grow food instead of lawn. We have just created a series of four small slightly raised beds in our back yard where we want to try veg-and-flower combos in the spring. Now I have to bother my horsey pals for some aged manure to supplement them. The beds are just large enough to attempt some basic salad plants without making too much work.

[Sibling Chatty]

Onions and garlic...alliums both--flower nicely, as does spent broccoli. Brocc has pretty tiny yellow flowers that are a lovely 'filler flower' type. I used to use the broccoli flowers from the garden in my church flower arrangements every fall.

Home grown or safely/organically grown carnations make great salads! A spicy taste, usually, and pretty. Make your average field greens or leaf lettuce a treat!