Your pet (& pictures) thread

[Bruder Cuzzen]

The brown we see makes him a brown tabby . A grey tabby has no brown at all , they are very "grey" , it helps the people at the shelters distinguish one tabby from another since so many are almost identical to another .

Stinker is a twin for my Fritz . .

Only really matters to the shelter folks tho .

[Sibling Chatty]

Lots of people qualify color by face color, since people tend to look at fares first.

Thus my lilac point tabby half Siamese from years ago. Face, feet and tail were perfectly lilac point Meezer...with a grey tabby body. My late husband called him Frankencat, but the vet in New Orleans listed him as a lilac point mixed breed.

[Bruder Cuzzen]

Frankencat.....HAAAAhahahaha

[anthrobabe]

Frankenweenie!

[anthrobabe]

my oldest daughter brought home a Beta yesterday. this thing is probably 1/2 inch long (not including 'plumage'etc-just his body) and is now in a 1 gallon tank with a fake frog, snake, and snail and two fake plants
my daughter stayed up all night with it-- scared to death it would die or something or starve or something.
what's she gonna do if it decides to go float on her?
give it CPR?

oh and the can of food will surely feed it for about 10 years

but it is a lovely fish!
so we are pet owners again

my mothers neighbors have baby goats again
i want one

[pieces o nine]

When I kept fish, there were always (male) bettas in the tank, sometimes with clear, perforated plastic dividers and plenty of screening camouflage plants to allow for more than one. They are very hardy and were usually the last fish left standing swimming. Eric the Red, in particular, outlived everybody, even a plecostomus.



They are also fairly inexpensive and available almost everywhere, so in the event of an untimely demise, have a funeral and get a replacement. Meanwhile, they're quite beautiful and she'll enjoy watching its dramatic finnage develop. (She may also be grossed out by the string of betta poo, like a long cigarette ash, trailing behind him!)

[anthrobabe]

nope she don't gross easily--

he is developing his personality already and he's got to be young-he has got to be the smalles betta I have ever seen. He is mainly a speckled greyish blue with fantastic red plumage.


Pieces or anyone-- do you know alot about them?  Mainly how they eat--- see below

The pet store lady had/has many of them and seems to know about them and she told anthrochild to just feed him tropical fish flake food and he would do fine and he does eat it and seems to be doing alright, she seems to need to crush it up into smallish pieces but he draws them in and then will spit them out and draw them back in.
However my daughter brought home some betta pellets last night to see if he'd 'like them' better-- he really hit on them but they seem to big for his mouth?
he swallowed about 2 ok-- do they chew?  I mean they will eat other fish so some sort of mastication has to occur or is it just tear and gulp like a shark would? Anyway one seemed to be way to big(but not obviously too big) and seemed to get stuck-- he swam around with it for a bit and she finally nudged his back fins with the net and he spat it out.
So naturally we are concerned about
A: getting enough food-- but not too much as overfeeding is a leading cause of fishy death I hear.
B: the correct food, they live about 2 years on average as I understand it and we want him around as long as possible.
C: is it helpful to put in a filtering system? we don't want to overdo it but the water is already a bit cloudy and don't want to overstress the fish by constant catch/clean tank/put back in.
D: light- do they need a lighted tank, or would a sunny but not direct sunlight spot do well--mimicing a natural cycle or sunrise to sunset or do they need more darkness?

as I understand it they are a shallow water fish from areas like ricepaddies and lowlying land that floods- that they do surface and gulp in air (breath)--so probably the water needs to be warm but also shallow water chills faster- so do they have a sort of temperature regulator?

I would like to explore having more, they do well in the shops in small perforated tanks with camo so that more than one can be in a tank.

[Bob in a quantum-state-of-faith]

I used to do tropical fish up in a big way.

Betas natural habitat is quite brackish water-- think "naturally polluted", so the cloudy probabily won't bother him.  They are partial air-breathers, and if the water becomes deficient in oxygen, they simply go to the surface, and gulp some air ... it's why they do well enough in a tiny brandy snifter that would suffocate a regular fish.

Betas also seem quite happy in very confined spaces, again do well enough in a brandy snifter.

That being said, ascetics including smell is not to be ignored.   So, a larger tank with a filtering system will be more pleasing to the human observer, and the beta won't mind if the water's clean.   And it will smell better.  MUCH better. 

Betas like to be solitary, and like a place to hide.  So, if you elect for a larger tank, put many and varied green things in there-- those fake plastic aquarium plants do quite nicely.  And, after a bit, algae will grow on the surface, rendering them actually plant-like.

Obviously, real plants are better, but require a deep gravel bed, and a well-established tank with lots of fishes putting out lots of ammonia (from their gills) and solids (from their neither ends) for the plants to thrive.

Alternatively, with a 5 gallon tank and 1 beta, you can add plant food instead.  But the deep gravel bed is a must.  Wait a couple of months for the fish to "populate" the gravel bed with healthy bacteria and such, for the plant's roots.   Your aquarium shop should have both the plants and the food.

Or, you could just stick with the plastic plants--- those never die, and look pretty good.

But, basically, fill up the tank with plants, leaving some "trails" or passages for the beta to swim around in-- he'll make himself quite at home.

Eventually, he will build a nest of bubbles in some corner or other.  If you then obtain a female, you can maybe get them to breed-- but it's a bit trickey.  You must watch carefully, for as soon as she emits her eggs, you MUST remove her to another locale, or the male will chase her literally to death.   He will take her eggs into his mouth, and blow them into his bubble-nest.

He will then watch carefully over these eggs until they hatch, and he will then tend to the tiny babies for a time.  Until they grow large enough to be a threat, when they must be removed, or he'll chase them to death, too.

Betas are very territorial.  Not unlike humans, in that respect.

------------

Back to your tank-- Cloudy water is usually a sign of grey-green bacteria growing crazy over a large food supply.

As in excess fish-food, a very common thing.   Overfeeding fish is so very easy to do-- in the wild, they do not get food every day, but they do get a huge variety, soo....

Cut back on the quantity of food you're feeding him.  All he can eat in a minute or less is more than enough.  He's just a small animal, and a flake or two is probabily more than he really needs at this stage.

Betas are carnivores, as are most fish.   And they typically swallow their prey whole-- little in the way of teeth.  The pellets are fine, if you use only one-- let him worry about it for a day or two.  Then wait a period for him to digest it, and add another.  He shouldn't choke-- if he can get it in his mouth, it's likely not too big. 

But, I'd stick to the flake for now.  My favorite was Tetramin brand, used to come in a plain yellow cardboard can, with a brown screw-top lid.  Other colors meant different things: red lid, blue lid, green lid, etc.

Once every coupla weeks, you can give him a treat, if you like: frozen brine shrimp, or frozen/freeze-dried worms.  These usually come in a clump that you can stick to the side of the glass.  They will thaw out, and your fish will pick at it for quite a while-- good for his activity.  But, don't feed him the regular food until he finishes the treat-- say a day or two.

You can raise your own brine shrimp, too-- it's fun.  And a bit of salt in your water is good for your beta anyway.

Another trick to help balance your little pond, is add some small pond snails.  Find a local stream that is not polluted with chemicals (farm fertilizer is okay) and gather a handful.  Dump'em in after a gentle washing, if you like.   Your beta will try to eat them-- let him, it's good for him anyway.

The snails are natural water-softeners, too.  They will draw minerals out of the water to build their shells.  Then, when they get picked to death by your fish, you remove the shells, and thereby remove some of the water-hardness.

Snails, like earthworms, are hermaphroditic-- so any two snails can make baby snails, if they are of the same species.  They will lay a small packet of eggs on the side or in the back of your tank.  These will hatch (if your fish don't find them first, and eat them) into teeny baby snails, some species the size of a pin-head or smaller. 

If the snails get too much-- simply crush them one at a time, and let your fishes feast on the meat inside.  Then remove the broken shells later.  A natural meat-treat. 

My fishes got so used to me reaching inside to crush the snails, that they would gather near my hand (I used my fingers) waiting in anticipation of a snail-snack. 

________________

My favorite type of filter is the under-gravel kind, with an electric pump on the riser tube.  This creates a natural aerobic bed of bacteria/algae that converts the ammonia from the fish's gills and the solid waste into harmless materials, easily absorbed by underwater plants/algae.   

The electric pump keeps the surface water moving, too, aerating it naturally, allowing for a denser population of fish that otherwise.   No messy/expensive changing of charcoal/pad filter media, either.

You can go months and months without any worries-- just once every two weeks or so, remove about 1/3 to 1/5 of the water, and add fresh back up to top.  This keeps the water's acid balance in check.  And the tiny bit of chlorine helps keep the microscopic critters in check too. 

Then, 2 times a year, you "vacuum" the gravel with a thingy to remove some of the natural "dirt" that collects between the gravel pieces.

You have to do this regardless of the type of filter anyway....

What else?  Hmmm. Can't think of anything at the moment....

[anthrobabe]

Thanks Bob


For now she is going to stick with the flake food-- it is stated for tropical fish(for colorful tropical fish) and seems to contain the same things as the pellets and he is having issues with the pellets for some reason. maybe later she can try again to give him some variety.

I have heard that some salt is good but not much and to use aquarium salt only.

We would just wind up making pets out of the snails, but a good idea.

The fake plants she has look fine anchored in gravel, he has already staked out a nice sleeping place, and he has room to 'run' as well. He ignores the fake snake (that is being removed soon thank you very much-it is stupid looking), but he hangs out by the fake turtle-possibly he sees it as what it is, an interesting shaped rock.

She cleaned his bowl yesterday--- we are probably going to go ahead and get a small filter system-not so much to aerate but to help keep the water fresh, he was very happy to be put into clear-treated water yesterday.

We have also discovered via various sources that it is a 'workout' for them to have a mirror placed near the bowl for a few minutes every once in a while- they think it is another male and will display like heck--- but not for too long as it is a workout and one should not over exhaust ones fishies, and not every day or even week as well.

[Bob in a quantum-state-of-faith]

<sub>(well crap!  I had a nice reply, and my STUPID mouse has some button I never noticed before, that is JUST placed in a spot to be pressed by the thumb-- that acts as a BACK BUTTON!  which totally erased my reply.....! 

Idiotic "engineers" who "design" stupid things WITHOUT REAL WORLD TESTING!  stupid-STUPID-stupid!  *sigh* )</sub>


anthrobabe: "I have heard that some salt is good but not much and to use aquarium salt only."

You heard correctly, and incorrectly.  

I've used ordinary table salt many times.   The best source, obviously, is real seawater-- only cost-effective if you live near the actual ocean--AND--if that water is not polluted by inland activity.  A big "if" these days.

The next-best (and they're all the same, really) is sea-salt.  "table" sea-salt is fine.  It contains more than just sodium chloride.  The aquarium stuff is usually more expensive than that, but not always.

The concentrations you'll typically use is 10%.  By that, I mean, if the ocean is 100%, and distilled is 0%, then 10% of the concentration found in the ocean would do.   An advantage of a commercial "salt water aquarium" package, is that it has prep directions-- just use 10% of what it states to make synthetic ocean, by weight or volume, whatever the package says.

Once you do that one time, you can switch to "table" sea salt, if you like.  Or even table salt.

The concentrations you're using put the trace minerals in the "too small to matter" column-- and all you're doing, really, is reducing the oxygen carrying capacity of the water a bit (for the most part).

The salt acts as a mild anti-microbe.  It cuts down a bit, on the algae growth, and the "cloudy water" effect.  And the fish doesn't care one way or another-- he will come to the surface, if the oxygen gets too low anyway.

An aside, ordinary black mollies (a freshwater tropical fish variety) are often acclimated to 100% ocean water.  Easy enough, if done over a period of time.  Then, you use the relatively cheap mollies as the "first in" fish in a new salt-water tank.  The first-in fish are at a very high risk in a salt water tank-- much more finicky water chemistry, here.

If you elect for a filter-- you'll probabily get one that uses in one way or another, activated charcoal.  There's a way to be quite thrifty with regards to charcoal.  Re-activate the "used" granules yourself.  How?

Easy: in your oven.  Spread out on a cookie sheet (preferably one with edges, keeps them on the sheet, and not down into the oven).  Set oven as high as it will go-- or better, just use the "clean oven" cycle if you have one.  Bake for an hour or so--or whatever the "clean oven" cycle normally is.  Too long is harmless.  Too short, and you don't bake out all the organic detritus.  Sun-drying does not get hot enough-- you really do need temperatures in the 400-500 degree (F) range for at least an hour.

The cost in electricity is pennies. And, you get a nice clean oven afterwards. 

I'd suggest purchasing a medium container of activated charcoal-- look for a nice sturdy plastic container, as you'll be re-using it for a long time.   You'll need a second one for the "used" charcoal, to hold until you've enough.  That way, you can immediately re-assemble your filter, and then bake-to-re-activate at your leisure, or when you've enough to make it worthwhile.

If your filter uses those VERY expensive "cartridges"--- examine it carefully.  It's likely that you can open it up, to dump out the "used" charcoal.  Rinse the bag under warm or hot water-- rinse it backwards (inside-out for a bag-type) from the normal water flow.  DO NOT USE SOAP OF ANY KIND!  Soap WILL kill your fishies!   The bag does not need to be spotless- it's not important, really.  It's ONLY there to hold in the "working parts" which is the activated charcoal pieces.    Carefully re-fill with new or newly re-activated charcoal, as much as will fit.  You can hold it closed with anything that's handy, so long as it can stand being immersed in water.  A plastic clip, etc.  Avoid metal, unless it's stainless steel.  The rust won't hurt your fish, but it could cut your finger next time-- not a good idea.   Or, just fold over the top of the bag, and re-insert.  Or just leave the top open-- it likely won't hurt anything.

One caveat here:  if you use a non-organic medicine to treat your fish for some malady or other-- you cannot re-activate that charcoal.  If you're in doubt if the medicine is organic or not (that is, if it is destroyed by high heat or not), discard the charcoal after the treatment is done-- say a day or three after you've stopped the treatment.   Most typical fish "medicines" are not destroyed by heat, so to be safe, I always discarded after-treatment charcoal.

In my pure undergravel-filter-only days, I had an "extra" simple charcoal-only type filter I'd have to put into the tank, to remove the medicine-treatment chemicals. 

As for the "workout"?  Fish don't need regular workouts like us mammals do.  But once in a while is harmless-- too much will stress him out, and that leads to various diseases. 

[anthrobabe]

right about the workouts-- fish don't need no stinkin pecs mon!

anyway-- thanks for the tips on the filters-- I think it would be less stressful on all involved.

and I forgot about sea salt sold at the regular grocery!

[Aggie]

I've been doing pretty well with a betta and 6 white cloud mountain fish (aka the "whities") in an approximately 4 - 5 gallon vase.  I change about half the water at a time using an improvised water pump (any type of siphon setup would work fine) - I am supposed to do this more than once per week, but the fish don't seem bothered if it goes up to 2 weeks (3 weeks?  Maybe longer?  ).  I have 3 stalks of lucky bamboo in the vase (had formerly floated a spider plant at the top) to help soak up some of the extra nutrients.  I wanted to avoid a filter or any other equipment with the setup, and it's done fine, so don't presume a filter is a necessity.  I used to have algae issues but moved the tank away from the window and don't have problems anymore.

Anthro, I find that a full tank cleaning & fish removal is not necessary in most cases, and have heard that totally changing the water can be risky since the fish will acclimatize to the ambient conditions and may be shocked by the change to clean water.  When I've been very neglectful and suspect the water is really nasty I will do several smaller water changes spaced hours apart.  I've only done a total drain to get at the algae once, and the worst of it can usually be gotten at by draining down the tank by about 2/3 and leaving the fish in place.  I keep gravel in a perforated plastic tub (ok, it's the bottom of a 2L pop bottle) so that it's easily removed for cleaning when it collects too much poo. 

I feed with frozen bloodworms, with flakes as a 'snack'.  We try to feed daily or every 2 days, but the fish aren't bothered if we miss a couple of days - I've left them for almost a week without food.

[pieces o nine]

Re: changing the water in the tank.
The person who got me all set up explained that as follows: Hmmm, looks the air around you is getting polluted. We'll just scoop you up, put you in a room which has had all the air pumped out of it for a few minutes, then pop you back into a sterile room with 100% fresh, clean air. It'll do wonders for you!

IOW: gentle on the tank changing. It sounds like you're getting lots of good technical advice from other aquarium-maintaining sibs. Stopped re-stocking mine when the fish kept disappearing at an accelerated rate. Kept blaming the hyper-aggressive Eric the Red until I returned home unexpectedly one day to find Eidolon (old cat) trying to use her body to block that her arm was under the flap and into the tank up to her armpit. A-ha.

Re: the 'workout' mirror.
I tried this a few times because it was interesting to see the "AGRESSION: ON!" reaction. But it also seemed kind of mean to wind 'em up like that. Besides, they needed all their energy to elude that wily criminal, 'the Fishing Paw'...

[Bob in a quantum-state-of-faith]

Water-changing is somewhat an art-form. according to some of the aquarium books I've read.

I had best luck, changing 10% at a time, about every 2 weeks or so.   That way, I could just dump in pure tap-water, no de-chlorination chemicals or anything.  The tiny bit of still-active chlorination is harmless to the fish, as is any fluorine.

The other sibs are right-- changing too much water at a time messes with the chemistry that the fish have acclimated to.

Betas are cool, though-- they don't need much at all.

Frozen bloodworms are fun to feed'em.  So are freeze-dried tubifex worms (I only now remembered that name).

Since betas are such carnivores, when a bit larger, they will enjoy the occasional fresh-caught bug, like a cricket or cockroach.  Or flies, etc.   Anything small enough that he can catch and eat whole.

If you've the stomach for it, you can obtain a female guppy (she will be gravid with eggs-- they are similar to rabbits, actually...)

Once she "hatches" her eggs, the babies will be live-born into the water.  You can then net these, and put in with the beta--who will gobble them up over the next few days. 

Some people would find that disturbing, though....   I used that method to weed out the undesirable babies.... so heartless, I know. 

After years of fishies, I switched to freshwater turtles.  Talk about fish-snacks.... I used to purchase live bait to feed my turtles-- they loved it.  The fish would last about 2 weeks, and there was always 1 or 2 who managed to elude the turtles. 

I had one "bait fish" for nearly 2 years that way-- he just kept on eluding and eluding.  Eventually, the bait-fish got so large, I removed him to the local lake (he was a local fish species anyway).   His reward for eluding the turtles.

The turtles "suffered" the same fate, too: when they would get more than 8" across, off to the lake (from whence they originally came, as babies).

My last pair actually laid some eggs, but alas they wouldn't hatch.  So I set the parents free.

*sigh*  That takes me back....

[anthrobabe]

Right-- I am learning that total water changes are not the way to go.

I could do guppies but not my daughter.

Today he seems to be taking to the mini-betta pellets just fine, possibly he was just in shock from the move--- imagine that  . So she is going to feed the pellets, with flakes and dried worms/shrimp as treats and maybe a caught bug or two now and again.

On another note the 35 'feeder goldfish' that were placed into a campus fountain in the middle of last summer by some still as unknown pirate  are still doing very well, they are getting BIG and just love the algae on the bottom--- the entire group just cruises and nibbles. They survived the winter with few losses--- I wonder if they will lay and breed? Best $3.50 a pirate ever spent in a mini free willy sort of way.
Added bonus-- there don't seem to be as many people disposing of cigarette butts in the fountain anylonger ....