Cell-Phone Tracking - Big Brother is Watching

[Aggie]

http://www.newsweek.com/id/233916

Scary stuff, this.  And no real way to avoid it, other than pulling the battery out of your phone or shielding it (and therefore not receiving calls). 

Of course there's that old line about not needing to worry if you're innocent.... 

[beagle]

I think the traditional bank robber technique is to use a new PAYG phone for each job and throw it away afterwards, never topping it up again or registering it.
Of course the chance of anywhere selling mobiles these days without having CCTV is probably fairly minimal, so you might have to pinch that too...

[Sibling Zono (anon1mat0)]

No need to pull the battery out, just turn it off. A new law recently passed makes all new cellphones GPS capable, although in some cases you can turn the GPS off, still you can get a general gist of someone's location just by the cell they're connected to.

The whole point then becomes one of usage, if you plan to do something and don't want anyone to tell where were you, turn off your cellphone, don't use toll roads that use automatic payment with a transceiver  (fastpass, sunpass, etc), avoid intersections with video cameras, highways, malls... erm...

Or do like the guy who was under suspicion of being a member of Al Qaeda that decided to publish every single thing he did in his website and sent a copy to the Feds on a daily basis.

We're screwed anyway.

[Aggie]

I think the traditional bank robber technique is to use a new PAYG phone for each job and throw it away afterwards, never topping it up again or registering it.
Of course the chance of anywhere selling mobiles these days without having CCTV is probably fairly minimal, so you might have to pinch that too...

That's exactly the problem - the smarter lot of criminals will stay ahead in this kind of arms race, while it remains an invasion of privacy for the average person.  Black-market SIM cards can probably get around the CCTV aspects of a normal purchase, too.

Of course, there are plenty of dumb criminals that this will work wonders against - at least until the vile liberal media starts alerting them to the possibilities.


I had heard rumours that a cell in the off position could be tapped into unless the battery was removed completely (for the purpose of listening via the microphone), but I can't back that up.  A metal cell phone case (i.e. tinfoil hat for your handy) might be enough to stop transmissions - when RFIDs become standard fare in IDs or credit cards, I'm getting a metal wallet.

[Sibling Zono (anon1mat0)]

An antistatic bag is enough although I seem to recall someone selling anti RF wallets, precisely because of the chips in the new credit cards.

Found the place:

http://www.difrwear.com/product-display.php

(passports have RFIDs too now)

[Aggie]

Not our passports - yet.  Gotta get mine renewed immediately (for travel) and should miss out on this for a few years. 

My current CC is not RFID'd AFAIK, although Mastercard (not my brand) is making this a standard.  The only RF card I know about is my work access card; one might need a wallet with dual compartments (protected and open). I wonder how hard it'd be to run minuscule transactions on passers-by with a properly set up RFID reader?  I also wonder if anyone would bother calling their CC company about a transaction charge of $0.00 on their bill (i.e. $0.0049 to avoid detection).  Set up innocuously in a traffic cone on a busy street or a wet floor sign in a transit station, this could 'harmlessly' strip a lot of money in a short time.  For cities with RFID-enabled transit card (Seoul for example) which can also be used for small purchases, stripping fractions of a cent in a subway station would be easy and nearly unnoticeable unless someone in a data centre caught wind of it, and it'd still be damned hard to physically catch someone provided they had a way of laundering the credits in bulk.

Passports are potentially scary, although the rumour is that they are starting to be metal-lined to prevent unauthorized reading when closed.

[Sibling Zono (anon1mat0)]

Visa is placing the darn thing on their cards too, the last credit card I got had the little vibes icon:

))))

[Sibling DavidH]

Our Visa cards haven't got it ... yet.

[Griffin NoName]

Could do with one of those RFID blockers for hotel keycards too

Actually, what I'd really like for hotel keycards is an anti-magnetic-clasp-on-handbag-wiping-the-magnetic-strip-data shield. It's another instance of gender discrimination where things like car seat belts are only designed for men; any woman will tell you, hotel keycards ar dumb, they stop working after a mere couple of days. But you only find out when you are dead tired trying to get into your room which is always the furthest away from reception. I now always program hotels phone numbers into my cell phone, sit on the floor, and phone them up to say I can't get in my room; make them do the trek to reprogram the damn thing.

<rant>

[Aggie]

I can sympathize, especially since I'm generally lugging at least 50 lbs of gear which is too valuable to leave sitting unsecured in front of my room(3-4 bags with shoulder straps + 2-3 instrument cases with handles + a couple of grocery bags; more than this and I'll use a luggage cart which generally can take three or four hundred pounds of sample coolers before the pneumatic tires run flat).

I suspect that some hotels actually set the cards to expire after 3 days, or else my hip pocket is just as toxic as your purse clasp.

BTW, I've been informed by a hotel worker that those card programmers can easily be used to copy credit cards onto the hotel blanks. 

[Griffin NoName]

I suspect that some hotels actually set the cards to expire after 3 days, or else my hip pocket is just as toxic as your purse clasp.

BTW, I've been informed by a hotel worker that those card programmers can easily be used to copy credit cards onto the hotel blanks. 

Do your jeans have studs?

Most hotels swipe my card on arrival. Goodness knows with what, where, how, but I reckon one is a sitting duck.

Incidentally, I adore the little safes they have. I stuff them full. But, then at xmas, I got a pack of nicotine replacement patches stolen from my room, so one can never beat the system entirely.

Re. RFID blocking, here's how to make your own

[Aggie]

Ayuh, but surely the studs aren't generally magnetized enough to cause issues?

I don't generally stay in hotels swank enough to have safes.  Or to be called hotels.


I've seen that wallet DIY before (here?) - neat idea, needs some style assistance.

[Griffin NoName]

walk backwards into a fridge door - that'll show if you have magnetic studs

[Aggie]

Wouldn't help, the fridge is lousy with rare-earth magnets that could magnetize any stud or wipe any card within 18 inches, I figure.

_{If one wanted to take revenge on a despised foe, hiding a rare-earth magnet in their wallet would do the trick nicely.}

[Scriblerus the Philosophe]

Re. RFID blocking, here's how to make your own

I like that. I'm contemplating how to mod my (very nice green leather) wallet to that end.

Wouldn't help, the fridge is lousy with rare-earth magnets that could magnetize any stud or wipe any card within 18 inches, I figure.

_{If one wanted to take revenge on a despised foe, hiding a rare-earth magnet in their wallet would do the trick nicely.}

Duly noted for ebbil uses in the future.

[Aggie]

Don't encourage me, Scrib. 

_{ok, ok, I'll put the NaOH away.....}

[Bob in a quantum-state-of-faith]

_{If one wanted to take revenge on a despised foe, hiding a rare-earth magnet in their wallet would do the trick nicely.}

MythBusters had an episode where they tried using magnets to wipe credit cards.

The results?  No go.

A fixed-field magnet (including all the rare-earth ones) is simply not going to have much effect on a magnetic stripe.

They tried several different varieties, leaving them overnight, etc.  Even some of Jamie's really honkin' huge rare-earth's the size and shape of hockey-pucks.  (and are strong enough to actually remove fingers, if caught underneath).  No effect-- their card reader was easily able to read the magnetic stripe after exposure to fixed-field magnets.

The key, is a moving-field magnet.   To get a fixed-field magnet to wipe a magnetic strip, you have to have either the magnetic strip or the magnet or both, moving quickly, and over a long period of time-- preferably random movements.  But even then, it does not always work reliably.

If reliable wiping is your goal:  switch to alternating-field magnets, or electromagnets powered by an AC current.  DC electromagnets are the same as fixed-field, permanent magnets, so they do not work.

But, those alternating-field AC-powered electromagnets?  They will wipe out *any* magnetic information from inches away....

---------------

How does he know all this, some may ask?

Years ago, back in the 80's, when I was deeply into a PC-based business, 5 1/4" floppy discs cost roughly $5 each, in bulk.  Much higher, in small lots.  So, I developed a regimen of recycling these into re-use.  I found the best method, was to blank-them out with AC-driven magnets, then re-format.  This ensured a nice clean "base" for the new data.  Simply reformatting them did not always work well, I discovered through experience.

And yes, I tried any number of fixed-field magnets, before settling on the field-coil salvaged from an AC-induction motor-- but it was pretty weak, and had to be physically passed over both sides of the disk, to ensure complete blankage.

From whence comes the inches away reference?  Telephones.

Back in those days (no cell phones, no electronic phones of any sort-- ancient Bell-inspired electromechanical phones only) all telephones had a lovely, and loud, bell-ringer.  This thing consisted of a pair of actual metal bells (like on a bicycle), with a metal clapper between them.  The clapper was driven by-- yep, an AC-powered electromagnet.  And it was incredibly inefficient-- most of the energy leaked out into the environment-- poor design.   The AC current is what caused the clapper to flop back and forth, striking each bell alternately.

Anywho, if you placed a 5 1/4" disk next to, underneath or near to one of these ancient testaments to barely good enough engineering, any time the phone rang, it would likely as not, wipe out your disk.

From inches away, even.   

Learned that the hard way. 

[Aggie]

I stand corrected - Myth busted!


And I do remember taking apart one of those telephones when young-ish.  I grew up with rotary-dial electromechanical phones.  I suppose inefficiency wasn't a big issue, because they were powered strictly off the telephone line, with nary an electrical outlet required.

You did clarify one point I'd wondered about - if rare-earth magnets can wipe a magnetic stripe / disc / tape from a short distance away, floppy discs would not have likely played nice next to hard drives in those old PCs without shielding (which they may have had, I don't have a clue there).

[Sibling DavidH]

I've got a videotape bulk eraser; the idea was it was supposed to restore the quality to much-used VHS tapes.  I couldn't be sure if it helped, but it  erases a floppy instantly.  I once did a bulk job for the charity: several dozen floppies wiped in a few minutes. (Of course, you have to reformat the floppies if you want to re-use them.)
Incidentally, when I've tipped out my junkbox of small screws, etc all over the table it'll pick all but the brass ones up and drop them back in the box in 2 or 3 goes.

[Swatopluk]

You did clarify one point I'd wondered about - if rare-earth magnets can wipe a magnetic stripe / disc / tape from a short distance away, floppy discs would not have likely played nice next to hard drives in those old PCs without shielding (which they may have had, I don't have a clue there).

Not to forget that the hard drives themselves are magnetic storage discs. I wondered how they could work with such a strong magnet in them.

[Pachyderm]

Just had an entertaining thought. If they can track your phone, what would make of a plot of my movements?

"Subject drove across the country, stopped for some reason (coffee), then carried on. Subject then left his vehicle (trace indicates subject no longer travelling at 70 mph), and wandered around a series of fields, apparently in a random manner. No link has been established between subject and registered owner of land. Subject drove to an area subsequently identified as woods, and wandered around, apparently in a random manner. No link has been established between subject and registered owner of land (City Council). Subject returned to vehicle, and returned to Belfast. We have no logical explanation for this behaviour, so are placing him on a watch list."

[Aggie]

There's going to be no need to be sneaky about it soon, thanks to apps like FourSquare and twittering - people are broadcasting their own whereabouts voluntarily.

http://technology.canoe.ca/2010/02/25/13019026-ap.html


LOL @ Patchy - I pack a SPOT (satellite personal tracker) unit when afield and alone.  Triangulating off the nearest towers doesn't work so well in the Canadian wilderness, 'cause there's rarely three in range.

[Sibling Zono (anon1mat0)]

Pachy, it's easier to put a harness on a cat and place the phone in it, the cat will do it's daily errands and eventually come back home.

Then you ask the feds/MI5/[insert domestic intelligence agency here] to finally solve the mystery of where does your cat go when (s)he leaves the house.

[Bob in a quantum-state-of-faith]

You did clarify one point I'd wondered about - if rare-earth magnets can wipe a magnetic stripe / disc / tape from a short distance away, floppy discs would not have likely played nice next to hard drives in those old PCs without shielding (which they may have had, I don't have a clue there).

Not to forget that the hard drives themselves are magnetic storage discs. I wondered how they could work with such a strong magnet in them.

Most of the magnetic energy is routed by iron straps around the magnets-- if you look at the construction, they are wrapped top and bottom with steel (usually plated).  Magnetic fields appear to "prefer" staying within magnetic elements, as opposed to within the air.

So those drives do contain two rare-earth magnets, within millimeters of the magnetic disk.  But the steel strapping keeps the magnetic fields in check.

But think on this:

A floppy disc, be it 5 1/4 or a 3 1/2 is basically a piece of Mylar plastic with a thin coating of rust on each side-- yet, you can have within fractions of a  millimeter-- two separate magnetic tracks on either side of that thin piece of plastic.

It's all in the intensity.