The Last Post Game!!!!

[Sibling Zono (anon1mat0)]

The survival of the liars.

Last _{or lawyers?} Post

[Swatopluk]

I an million years there will only be two species left on Earth: termites and lawyers
One are those unsatiably voracious monsters, the other are small white ant-like creatures.
Whichever afflicts you, the house will be lost.

Last _{Shakespeare, Henry VI(part 2), Act IV, Scene II} Post

[Sibling Zono (anon1mat0)]

It makes my pessimistic self wonder who will be the survivors of the mess that fast approaches.

Last _{and I suspect it will be the bad sort the one that will survive} Post

[Swatopluk]

Ironically it's likely the social Darwinists that are anti-social Darwin deniers

Last Post

Btw, I like this one

http://www.cakewrecks.com/storage/thumbnails/10710906-13909708-thumbnail.jpg?__SQUARESPACE_CACHEVERSION=1314937828563

[Sibling Zono (anon1mat0)]

Are psychopaths strictly speaking social darwinists?

Last _{either the rich and unempathetic or the sociopathic MadMax barbarians that will survive the revolution/Armageddon} Post

[Swatopluk]

Deepnds* on individual beliefs. In the most narrow sense a sociopath would not need any ideology or it would even disqualify him/her.


And now for something completely different: Darth Vader playing the trombone
[youtube=425,350]07IhWD2Lr2A[/youtube]
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=07IhWD2Lr2A

*accidental typo but deep-ends would also fit nicely

[Aggie]

 

Last _{human evolution suggests that altruistic communities will ultimately prosper in a civilization-disrupting event; I have no doubt that 100 farmers with hand tools can overcome a few madmen with guns, be better fed for the fight, and more resourceful in ambush and guerrilla tactics} Post

Incidentally, is it possible to use black powder in modern cased munitions, say for an AK-47?  In a global collapse, nitrocellulose propellants may become a little hard to come by. Handloading and bullet casting are not hard to do, but one needs gunpowder.  Black powder isn't difficult to make from reasonably obtainable compounds; nitrification is trickier, more dangerous and requires good-quality acids.  If we are back to uncased black-powder weapons, edged weapons and bowmen become plausibly effective in large numbers.

[Swatopluk]

It is possible but you'll not be happy with the results. Nasty recoil, almost immediate sliming of the barrel etc. Also black powder is more tricky to reliably produce than it seems. Not every type of charcoal or sulphur will do and the mixing is an art (or the results will vary widely even with the perfect ingredients at hand).

Btw, unless you go back to flintlocks, you'll need primers/ignition caps and those are really tricky.

Bows would be nice but those too are more than bent pieces of wood, requiring significant skills to produce and use. For close(r) encounters slingshots (They Y things with the rubberband, not King David's) would be a very good choice. Light crossbows have their use too.

Old proverb: It takes 7 years to learn the use of the bow, 7 weeks for the crossbow and 7 days for the arquebuse (=gun)

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[Aggie]

Good, that levels the playing field (the rich will still keep factories I'm sure, but small warlords might not have access).  

I'm a dab hand with a mortar and pestle, and an aspiring charcollier (willow for fireworks; I suspect hardwoods for powder but would have to consult Mr. Davis' lovely little book to check).  From what I know of the process, it's less ambitious that some of my cooking projects; less ingredients than my fresh curry pastes, which are similarly explosive.  Sulphur would be the most difficult to round up, although saltpetre might take a little thinking to get a good purification and testing method sussed out.

Bows and crossbows?  Not outside of my woodworking skills, from what I know.  I don't have the skills yet to use a bow. I intend to learn some basic forging skills eventually, probably enough for hardware on a crossbow and certainly enough for basic polearms and arrowheads.

Gunsmithing and cannon-casting are probably out of my league, let alone the mining and smelting bits.  Basic tube-launched mortar shells and rockets are probably within my ken, with a little experimentation.  You don't need a metal tube to launch a mortar.

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[Swatopluk]

Don't forget the blowpipe, provided you have something to tip the darts.
Medieval arrowheads in Europe turned out to be quite hightech. Some were found to have a soft core, a specially hardened point and sharpened blades welded to it. Archers also had the choice between different heads depending on the target (no armor, leather armor, gambeson, mail, plate). Nothing primitive there.

Steel bows were less powerful than the best yew bows but probably needed less maintenance and are (apart from very cold winters) less sensitive to climate.

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[Aggie]

There are species of plant up here useful for poisoning arrows, although probably not strong enough for a blowgun dart.  I suppose it depends on the stability of cicutoxin; that should be potent enough if it's air and light stable.   Exceptionally straight elder canes could work for the pipe, I suppose.

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[Swatopluk]

To my knowledge blowpipe hunters posion their arrows directly before use from closed containers. Skythian horse archers had special quivers to both separate posioned from non-poisoned arrows and to preserve the posion. Antiquity also knows a special archer belt with a golden vial attached to it. It is assumed that this served as a poison container.
Poison can be quite stable. Poisoned arrow (heads) were found that were 1300 years old but with the poison still potent.

I just finished a book on 'biochemical' warfare in antiquity and am still reading the massive study on the European warbow.

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[Aggie]

Hmmm....  cicutoxin extracted into a suitable solvent - a glycol perhaps, for added viscosity.  As we're speaking about low-tech applications, perhaps glycerol from soapmaking. Crushed and juiced plant materials might be enough alone, but may not stay as well preserved. Should be reasonably stable; there's little to react other than the two -OH functional groups:



The traditional arrow-poison in my area is False Hellebore (Veratrum spp.), but it tends to occur mostly at higher altitudes.  Water hemlock is reasonably common around the many mid-elevation lakes, which would make fine hideouts.

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[Sibling Zono (anon1mat0)]

Crossbow. If you have access to some steel it shouldn't be too difficult to manufacture one, and with some practice you can have a very powerful weapon.

Same with a cannon, finding metal pipes isn't out of the question and the options for soldering aren't that difficult be it arc or some combustible similar to acetylene.

This assumes that we will be in the remains of the current civilization.

Last _{now, if you are in the middle of the jungle blowpipes are the easier weapon, acknowledging their low range and the problem getting the toxins if all poisonous frogs are gone} Post

[Swatopluk]

Well, many jungle plants are poisonous.
The cicutoxin looks highly reactive to me with all its conjugated double bonds, one of them in allylic position to the hydroxy group.

Last _{cannons have been made from leather. There is one at the local* history museum} Post

*which happens also to be the national one