My position: Against.
I have just discovered Blogging Against Disablism Day will be on 1st May, 2009 (http://blobolobolob.blogspot.com/2009/04/blogging-against-disablism*-day-will-be.html) so I've missed it. If there is to be a day for Anything, then there should be days for Everything, which is untennable. No one could keep track, and anyway with so many, the existing ones are already getting devalued.
*my english language morality is having convulsions at the "disablism" wordisming :o
I'll bite.
Humans are fickle and uninterested unless a problem touches them directly, so something like say, multiple sclerosis is out there and a significant problem for those who suffer it, the rest wouldn't care one bit unless they themselves or any of their direct family is affected. How is that improved by "MS awareness day"? By reminding the rest that the problem exists, that it requires energy to be solved and that perhaps 'you' may be affected by it at some point. While it may be a small gesture and the effect might be smaller, the more people become aware of it the better.
Your turn. ;)
Quote from: Sibling Zono (anon1mat0) on May 15, 2009, 02:04:49 PM
Your turn. ;)
Anyone can join in !
You haven't addressed my point about days for Everything. How on earth should it be decided what is important enough to bring to people's attention and following your line of argument, what needs awarenes-raising most? Then there's the issue of how many "Issues" should be linked to each day of the year. it's a minefeld. At present just anyone can declare any day a "Wotist Day". That is plain silly.
Once there is a "Wotsit" day, endless marketing evolves linking colours and emblems and wrist-bands etc and such-like to it. Witness Pink for Breast Cancer - I love the colour pink and I hate it having been appropriated for BC. And there aren't enough colours and our arms aren't long enough for all the wristbands that might link to days we support ;D
I disagree, 'wotsits' day is the ultimate marketing enterprise, and only those making the effort to market their day get to decide if it will be prominent or not, it's a free market, no? ;)
Nevertheless not all days can get the prominence of others (ie, mother's day) but that doesn't undermine the effort done for the few souls that get exposure to issue at hand, in other words, regardless of how many issues are taken on the 365 days of the year only a few will get most attention giving hopes to the little ones and success to the big ones. 'Wotits Day' is the ultimate capitalistic enterprise even if money isn't exchanged on the process, fostering creativity, competition and ultimately awareness of the brand in question.
Are you a communist to attack one of our sacrosanct institutions?
(oh goat, where art thou? :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen:)
An example. As a mother I would like a constant appreciation. I don't want it all on one day, thank you. Having such a day gives people the excuse to avoid thinking about "Wotist" on all other days. As marketing enterprise that's pretty poor as for example on selling "Wotsit" Day cards on one day a year. So, it's not even a good brand awareness tool. In fact it could be described as an anti-branding tool.
Now, consider. Breast Cancer has co-opted a whole month - October. This gives more opportunity for raising money* and theoretically awareness. But in reality, this is madness gone even further. More and more "Wotsits" will start converting their Days to Weeks and then Months. Soon we will have whole millenia dedicated to "Wotsits" Millenia. See, mathematically the idea is senseless.
* and who are they raising this money for? I am sure many Mothers would love the proceeds from Mother's Day instead of the tacky box of chocolates that is intended to make up for being ignored the rest of the year. But more usually the money made is supposedly for charity, until one analyses the actual percentage that makes it through to the deserving people.
But isn't precisely mother's day when we heard that all days should be mother's day? The intention of every single one of those marketing enterprise is to overwhelm the awareness to their cause/product, hopefully all the time, the same way the goal of any entrepreneur is to be the largest seller of it's wares all over, but that doesn't mean that they reach such privilege, as my gran used to say, you have to aspire to pope to become an altar boy, IOW don't be fooled by their desires, remember that with luck they'll only get a couple of minutes worth from the public's attention span in the best case scenario, making the effort even more important to their cause.
In all seriousness it's a matter of symmetry, if all efforts where managed in the same way it certainly would become useless noise, and in fact I'd dare say that some of those trying to grab a day, week or month of attention are already considering if that approach is the most effective, but the reality is that all efforts are indeed asymmetric making some causes more prominent than others and gaining the most attention. Some are legitimate marketing enterprises (like Valentine's, Mother's or even Halloween) that get lot's of traction because they are a source of revenue for a number of industries, some can only aspire to a passing mention on the news and many don't even get that.
I say those are a legitimate ways to gather attention in a world where a second of your attention is worth millions, and if you don't like the effort the best thing you can do is just ignore it, you wouldn't be the only one doing it.
Quote from: Sibling Zono (anon1mat0) on May 15, 2009, 05:11:08 PM
Are you a communist to attack one of our sacrosanct institutions?
(oh goat, where art thou? :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen:)
It's very confusing. Goat's a communist, but Zhao Ziyang turns out to have been an Evil imperialist lackey running dog (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/asia/china/5324065/Chinese-leader-condemns-Tiananmen-massacre-from-beyond-the-grave.html).
Unless it's another Hitler diary episode...
---
I have no opinion on special days, as I never remember them.
Quote from: Sibling Zono (anon1mat0) on May 15, 2009, 08:10:36 PM
..............if you don't like the effort the best thing you can do is just ignore it, you wouldn't be the only one doing it.
Quote from: beagle on May 15, 2009, 09:40:34 PM
I have no opinion on special days, as I never remember them.
I never remember them either. But I can still have an opinion on them.............and when I come across them, I do ignore them.
I don't believe buying useless/rubbish stuff -with a tag to some virtually arbitrary worthyness - is a good way to promote anything. It's all part of the western pre-occupation with spending money for the sake of spending money.
Quote from: Griffin NoName on May 15, 2009, 11:04:42 PM
I never remember them either. But I can still have an opinion on them.............
Is this a case of "I don't play golf but I still have a (terrible) opinion about the sport" or a case of "I don't kill people but I still have a (terrible) opinion about murder"?
;) :mrgreen:
Yes.
By and large, most of these special days/weeks/months are of a bovine scatalogical nature as far as I'm concerned. There aren't enough days or months or weeks for all the issues that are important and like Zono said, cramming the calendar with them means they mean even less. I don't care about BC month, Black history month, Asian history month, MS day, father's day, or even mother's day*.
There has to be another vehicle of delivery to get across the importance of being aware of lupus, BC, mothers, Blacks and Asians in American history, and MS. I don't have an answer, but having those sort of days doesn't really mean anything.
I do have an exception because I am fickle and only care when it addresses an issue I care about (;)) because I like Labor day (and I like it on the day everyone else celebrates it on). Oh, and I like Mol day. But other than that, those days our calendars are crammed with (secretary's day, anyone?) mean nothing to me.
*I'd prefer not to have this misinterpreted in the light of the rest of the post--my parents are important to me. The date set aside for them means nothing.
Quote from: Scriblerus the Philosophe on May 16, 2009, 12:24:59 AM
(secretary's day, anyone?)
That's an interesting example. First of all the concept is outdated, there are far less secretaries nowadays and the ones that remain would never agree to be called secretaries, and much rather be called "[insert euphemism here] assistants". But the day had an importance in the time were secretaries were ubiquitous, ignored and/or mistreated. The fact that chauvinism has subsided a bit may be part of the recognition they achieved back in the day. The fact that it doesn't matter anymore doesn't mean that it didn't reached it's goal.
Quote from: Sibling Zono (anon1mat0) on May 16, 2009, 02:28:08 AM
Quote from: Scriblerus the Philosophe on May 16, 2009, 12:24:59 AM
(secretary's day, anyone?)
That's an interesting example. First of all the concept is outdated, there are far less secretaries nowadays and the ones that remain would never agree to be called secretaries, and much rather be called "[insert euphemism here] assistants". But the day had an importance in the time were secretaries were ubiquitous, ignored and/or mistreated. The fact that chauvinism has subsided a bit may be part of the recognition they achieved back in the day. The fact that it doesn't matter anymore doesn't mean that it didn't reached it's goal.
Something I hadn't thought about. I think it may have been before my time or conscious awareness of time.
Quote from: Scriblerus the Philosophe on May 16, 2009, 12:24:59 AM
(secretary's day, anyone?)
Flag day
International Pancake day
Spamarama
Flag day:
Quote from: wikipediaIn 1916, President Woodrow Wilson issued a proclamation that officially established June 14 as Flag Day
Look for timing and context, in the middle of WWI and promoted by the seated president. Considering how ubiquitous flags are in the US I dare say the [nationalistic] effort succeeded.
International Pancake Day:
Again context, according to wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Pancake_Day) the day was invented as a protestant tradition prior to lent. Now, can you blame IHOP for running with this one?
Spamarama (http://www.spamarama.org/history.html):
This one is trickier, although it becomes obvious that it was a sanctioned marketing device for the restaurants that started it and for the city of Austin once the ball was running.
Again, the importance of any 'wotsit' day is related to the 'tribe' that started it and it's goals. Perhaps some are too local for you and I to care (like spamarama) but they certainly have their function in the marketing of the cause/product in question. IOW attacking 'wotsit' days is the equivalent of attacking TV/radio commercials because the annoyance brough by those.
Rather than attacking 'wotsit' days in general I would attack the ones with which I disagree, the same way you don't attack other marketing enterprises unless you consider them unsavory or of dubious morality (like say, prescription drug advertising).
All right, point. Means I'm only going to support International Mol day, Pi day (I actually *did* do pi day this year), Festivus, talk like a pirate day, towel day, but mostly Labor day* and Lupus Awareness day. I *would* do Moosemas, but well... :'(
To boil it down, I guess, funny holidays, Labor day, and anything for lesser known but still important diseases.
*what pisses me off in regard to this holiday is that we celebrate it six months later here in the US. It's May 1st everywhere else because it also memorializes the Haymartket Massacre in 1886 in Chicago. We were pressured into celebrating it at all and for stupid political reasons, moved it to September.
Quote from: Scriblerus the Philosophe on May 16, 2009, 05:32:54 PM
what pisses me off in regard to this holiday is that we celebrate it six months later here in the US. It's May 1st everywhere else because it also memorializes the Haymartket Massacre in 1886 in Chicago. We were pressured into celebrating it at all and for stupid political reasons, moved it to September.
Ahhh, but that is because May 1st is a communist day, in fact labor unions are communist and if it weren't because of them workers wouldn't have rights they way it always has been... besides who wants some stinkin' French creation (unless is the really Belgian fries and some robed lady stranded in a island on the Hudson)?.
Quote from: Sibling Zono (anon1mat0) on May 16, 2009, 04:27:24 PM
............ IOW attacking 'wotsit' days is the equivalent of attacking TV/radio commercials because the annoyance brough by those.
Rather than attacking 'wotsit' days in general I would attack the ones with which I disagree, the same way you don't attack other marketing enterprises unless you consider them unsavory or of dubious morality (like say, prescription drug advertising).
I abhor commercials and avoid them by recording stuff and skipping them, or by using the time to do things in other rooms while they are on. They are annoying, stupid, and generally untruthful all in the cause of selling products. It is the same as "Wotsit" Days and nothing wrong with disagreeing with both.
There is no way of communally democratically allowing or disallowing "Wotsit" days that I am aware of; so attacking, as an individual, ones disliked is a bit pointless and hides the bigger picture anyway.
Quote from: Sibling Zono (anon1mat0) on May 16, 2009, 07:02:21 PM
Quote from: Scriblerus the Philosophe on May 16, 2009, 05:32:54 PM
what pisses me off in regard to this holiday is that we celebrate it six months later here in the US. It's May 1st everywhere else because it also memorializes the Haymartket Massacre in 1886 in Chicago. We were pressured into celebrating it at all and for stupid political reasons, moved it to September.
Ahhh, but that is because May 1st is a communist day, in fact labor unions are communist and if it weren't because of them workers wouldn't have rights they way it always has been... besides who wants some stinkin' French creation (unless is the really Belgian fries and some robed lady stranded in a island on the Hudson)?.
...French?
Quote from: Scriblerus the Philosophe on May 17, 2009, 03:33:48 AM
...French?
According to wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Workers%27_Day#History):
Quote from: International Worker's Day articleIn 1889, the first congress of the Second International, meeting in Paris for the centennial of the French Revolution and the Exposition Universelle, following a proposal by Raymond Lavigne, called for international demonstrations on the 1890 anniversary of the Chicago protests.[citation needed] These were so successful that May Day was formally recognized as an annual event at the International's second congress in 1891.
So as you can see, while the day remembers the protests on Chicago the day was created in Paris. :P
Quote from: Griffin NoName on May 16, 2009, 07:06:24 PM
I abhor commercials and avoid them by recording stuff and skipping them, or by using the time to do things in other rooms while they are on. They are annoying, stupid, and generally untruthful all in the cause of selling products. It is the same as "Wotsit" Days and nothing wrong with disagreeing with both.
There is no way of communally democratically allowing or disallowing "Wotsit" days that I am aware of; so attacking, as an individual, ones disliked is a bit pointless and hides the bigger picture anyway.
In a saner world TV would be really free and programs paid for with advertising, so by rejecting the commercials you reject TV and in consequence you shouldn't have one or use it only for prerecorded media like DVDs and the like.
But the thing is that in your case that's not true! You have to pay a license to watch TV and on top of that you get the stupid commercials (same here with cable*).
In any case the point is that 'wotsit' days are a form of marketing and unless you are against all forms of marketing (and willing to go back to a hunter-gatherer kind society) you can't blame them for promoting their wares.
*in fact I don't watch over the air channels anymore, but I get the bloody commercials in paid for (ie cable) programs. I am against those commercials myself.
Quote from: Sibling Zono (anon1mat0) on May 17, 2009, 04:35:37 AM
In a saner world TV would be really free and programs paid for with advertising, so by rejecting the commercials you reject TV and in consequence you shouldn't have one or use it only for prerecorded media like DVDs and the like.
But the thing is that in your case that's not true! You have to pay a license to watch TV and on top of that you get the stupid commercials (same here with cable*).
I disagree. In a saner world all TV would be paid for by license with no need for commercials. In my case, I pay a license fee so I can have a TV and watch BBC without any ads. I would really really hate to give that up. Hurrah for the BBC !
Commercials would be replaced by accurate factual information about new products so that people could get to know about them - on a separate channel so as not to interrupt real programs.
Quote from: Sibling Zono (anon1mat0) on May 17, 2009, 04:35:37 AM
In any case the point is that 'wotsit' days are a form of marketing and unless you are against all forms of marketing (and willing to go back to a hunter-gatherer kind society) you can't blame them for promoting their wares.
Depends on how you define marketing. Anniversay days like Bastille Day (let's stick with the French) are merely commemorative. If you call that marketing history, then you may have a point. Banning marketing in my book would not return us to hunter-gatherer; banning information might, but that is not marketing. (anyway I bet hunter-gatherers had methods of informing each other where good hunting and gathering grounds were).
Oh nononono, every enterprise in which you are promoting goods or services (or even concepts) is an exercise in marketing, it may have a (very) bad reputation but it is still a legitimate endeavor. Hopefully it is factual without deceptive practices and informative but it doesn't change the main goal which is to put a particular product, service or idea in the minds of others; it can be one on one (word of mouth), using unconvetional channels (guerrilla marketing), delivering free samples, or declaring a particular day/week/month of the year as 'wotsit' day/week/month.
Remember that the only way you may want something (from whipped cream to a cure for BC) is if you are aware of it, which is in itself the goal of marketing. The fact is that some information sources become marketing channels (and highly valued) making that note on the news about, say, the papilloma virus vaccine an unwitting marketing vehicle for the laboratory selling it. The case for 'wotsit' days is precisely to use those more reputable channels.
You may want to regulate marketing but you can't ban it.
IMO you are stretching marketing to mean far more than the word merits. I suggest you consult the meaning of "marketing" (http://www.learnmarketing.net/marketing.htm) ;D
Promoting memories of the unfortunate folk who lost their heads by having a Bastille Day is just that: promoting memories (one would like to think it was also teaching people to learn from the past but they never do). It has nothing to do with marketing whatsoever, but it is a "wotsit" day.
By the way, are you really suggesting we should have a "papilloma virus vaccine" Day ?
Quote from: Griffin NoName on May 18, 2009, 12:42:38 AM
IMO you are stretching marketing to mean far more than the word merits. I suggest you consult the meaning of "marketing" (http://www.learnmarketing.net/marketing.htm) ;D
For the love of pete! That page is written in MarketingSpeak
TM! No wonder you are confused.
Quote from: learningmarketing.netThe Chartered Institute of Marketing define marketing as 'The management process responsible for identifying , anticipating and satisfying customer requirements profitably'
:barf: ;) :P
Quote from: Griffin NoName on May 18, 2009, 12:42:38 AM
By the way, are you really suggesting we should have a "papilloma virus vaccine" Day ?
I'm sure the marketing department of Merck has discussed the matter already.
I think that just about wraps up this debate. I vote Against the motion !
;D